The point applies here. I thing we worry too much about the law too much sometimes. Paul even says that the Law of the Spirit of Life in Christ Jesus has set us free from the law of sin and death. Though tithe strikes the pocket book of the believer and is one of the fundalmental teaching of the modern, post modern… pick-a-modern christian. The bible says be a cheerful giver. If you can’t be cheerful about 10% because your lights are going to be turned off on Monday then try 5% or if your cheerful at 25% then go for it. George Muller and other ministers of the 1800’s are recorded as giving God 90% and living off of 10%.

So to sum up this long winded burlb, ask God. I would worry more about doing what God says do when he says it and worry about the minial stuff for long debates in Heaven. I’m not knocking the fundamental practice but I’m more concerned with the issue of the heart.

I personally (no doctrine foundation so take with a grain of salt)

In truth, tithes were just the beginning of what folks gave. There were offerings beyond tithes, gifts beyond tithes and offerings. One study I saw said that for the more wealthy in the ancient Jewish society, the tithes plus offerings (the cost of the bull or doves for sacrifices etc), and things like the “gleanings” they were to permit added up to a third or more of their (potential) income. (I say potential, since the requirement not to harvest “to the corners” and not to go over a field a second time upon harvesting but let the poor do that and keep it for themselves is more “lost income” than a gift in some matter of thinking).

Yet we don’t hear about this — do we?

Generosity — yes. Forced or obligatory giving? Meaningless. God loves the cheerful giver.

Unfortunately The best i can find to support what i believe is in the old testament EXODUS 25:2 “Speak unto the children of Isreal that they bring me an offering of every man that giveth it willingly with his heart ye shall take my offering” I’m saying based on that the 10% thing outta be right out the window. If you ask me to give 10% then i’m not giving willingly with my heart am I? I DO believe that to be a guideline that would be expressed to someone completely ignorant on how much to expect to give.

Here is annother that supports my arguement in the new testament Matthew 10:8 “Heal the sick, Cleanse the lepers, raise the dead, cast out devils: FREELY YE HAVE RECEIVED, FREELY GIVE.” You have been blessed give what you can!! i don’t think we need to relive the temple with the poor woman who gave all she had but it’s the thought that counts here including what is said to the pharasees if you need to show compassion and help a poor starving family that god has called you to help i believe that to be better than a regular donation to the church. give what you can give where you can and……

Luke 6:38 “GIVE AND IT SHALL BE GIVEN TO YOU ; good measure, pressed down, shaken together and running over shall men give into your bosom for with the same measure that ye mete withal it shall be measured to you again” The more you give the more I’ll give is the promise Jesus made here. I give to you to do my work the more you do that the more you can be trusted to handle more.

that’s where i am on the subject Yeah you should ultimately give 10% as a guideline but if you can’t because you need it for other places in gods work do it. There’s more in there too about doing god’s work as part of your tything but my eyes are going cross eyed just looking at it now. i’m not looking it up. 10% of your free time mayhaps??

good luck and let me know how you make out further.

I’m not going to come down on one side or the other on this issue. However, I have a few observations that I would like to make:

1) Fish, I think it’s fair to state that you have come to this current conclusion on tithing based on what you know, now and where you are in life, now, and what you feel the Lord has spoken to you, thus far in your walk with Christ. As such, it’s probably also fair to state that over the next 40, 50 or even 70 years, you may come across new insight and revelation that could change your mind. Maybe, maybe not. But considering the volatile nature of the issue, I would warn against touting this “revelation” as the be all, end all on tithing for several reasons: 1) the point I mentioned just above, 2) your level of influence with younger believers that are drawn to your natural charisma and leadership, and 3) because since you do not currently stand in a Pastoral role you do not want to set yourself up adversarily against other ministry gifts (i.e. Pastors, Teachers, etc.) who are being held accountable for the people that God entrusts to their Pastoral care.

2) Good and honest men and women of God teach different doctrines, and have different, even opposing views on tithes and offerings. So any conversation on the topic certainly warrants a bit of humility, regardless of the side of the issue you are on.

3) The issue of spiritual authority comes to mind. If God has directed you to be a part of a local church or body, then you are to a certain extent, held accountable to support the vision of that house and submit to the authority over that house. And if God directs you to be part of a local body that believes and supports tithing, then keep in mind that God already knew that this particular local church believed in and supported tithing before He sent you there. In other words, He knowingly sent you to be part of a vision that supports a particular doctrine. Logic would dictate that if you are to follow His direction in your life, you will go into this work supporting vision as best you can, which would include their doctrine on tithing. Now obviously, one could take the concept of spiritual authority to absurd extremes and I am not advocating that, but one should keep the concept in mind regarding this discussion.

4) “Escape clause” Christians. Fish, I think you are doing an OK job of this, so far, but always keep in mind that there are many young Christians, who don’t know Scripture, who don’t yet know how to mature in the Lord, and they will only half-read your “discovery” and come away thinking it means “I don’t have to tithe, erego, I don’t have to give.” Now I know that’s not what you’re saying, but any believer looking for a financial “escape clause” could potentially find one in your writings. I’ve always believed that it’s not only important what you say and how you say it, but also who you say it too.

5) “Study to show thyself approved.” Folks, don’t just take Fish’s word on this. Don’t just take your favorite preacher’s word on this issue either. But be willing to take ownership of your own spiritual development and study out the issue scripturally. Prayerfully look at both sides, and with humility, seek counsel from your Pastors and spiritual fathers.

6) Perspective. I wonder if we would even be having this discussion if we all lived in debt-free houses, drove debt-free cars, made 20 million dollars a year, only only needed two-thousand dollars a month for living expenses. If a person was in a position to give or “tithe” at a rate of 20, 30, 40 or even 50%, then would we be having this conversation? So how much accountability should we as believers be taking with regards to our own financial stewardship (i.e. staying out of debt and being good stewards)?

7) Love – do all that you do in a way that allows you to love the Lord your God with all of your heart, soul and strength, and to love your neighbor as yourself.

“You can give without loving, but you can’t love without giving.”

If the church would get a hold of this concept, they wouldn’t worry about making the TITHE mandatory and preaching doctrine that is not Biblically sound. Pastors worry about paying the church bills, paying the staff, paying this and that… but where is the higher calling that God has called us to? That being a life of FAITH! Where does your supply come from? Man or God? Obviously, if a person loves God, he will be compelled to give where He has placed His name.

“But my God shall supply all of my need according to his riches in glory”, not whether or not the people live under the misconception of tithing. People will continue to give regardless of a 10% rule. This is where they get the opportunity to have the Lord move on their hearts to give. And I would think the church would be ready for this. For it’s members to be talking to the Lord to find out what they should give. It is only if you are afraid the people wont talk to God that keeps us holding on to a guarantee of a 10% of everyone’s money. If this is the case, it would seem that we are back to Old Testament days when the law was given in place of the relationship God offered the people.

To site the above statement: God asked the people to approach Mt. Zion and he would descend upon it and talk with them. The people were afraid and sent Moses instead. They didn’t want to talk with God. You know what God did? He said if you don’t want to come up to talk with Me, you get rules to govern us. If relationship is not what you want, rules is what you get to keep us good. And Moses came down with the 10 commandments. But I digress, I am off on a tangent now. The tithe is taught today because our pastors and ministers don’t trust that the Lord will move on the people to give what is neccessary. They don’t trust that they will be praying and hearing from the Lord on what they should give. Or is it that they are too lazy to being praying that the Lord will move on the people or move on their behalf. To stretch their own faith to see the church’s needs met. Because should they trust the Lord, the helm of the ship is no longer in their hands. Which by the way, not to dig here, but isn’t the ship supposed to be lead by God?

It is a shame that we bring people to Jesus based on it being a free gift of salvation, but once they get saved and become members, we tell them to continue or to be able to give back to the church or minister in that church in any capacity that they must give 10% of whatever they make. Sounds like the government, politics and a club… not the church that Paul was trying to build in the name of Christ.

Just saying is all…..